450 Words: Ryan Dungey Interview
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PrintWe have talked to Ryan Dungey plenty of times this year, but we'll put a bow on the 2012 AMA Supercross and Motocross season with one last chat here, before RD5 (or RD1) heads over to Belgium for the Motocross of Nations. Then we'll probably talk to him again there….and then after the Monster Energy Cup! Such is life at the front of the pack.
Racer X: Talk about your first season with a new bike, new team, building it and where you are now at the end of the season, champion and working on all cylinders.
Ryan Dungey: Yeah, it feels great. I felt like we made improvements a lot there during the middle of the season and so forth. To keep winning from round three on was great too, especially those last two races. I finished on a strong note and kept carrying this momentum. It was fun. I had a lot of fun this season. The guys at KTM, my family, you’ve got to thank everybody who got us to this point. All the success we had was because the guys were working hard. So I really appreciate it.
It's been a magical 2012 season for Ryan Dungey and KTM.
Simon Cudby photo
You talked about KTM having a good season in 450s and 250s. You’ll be known as “that guy” in the history books that really helped KTM step to the forefront. What does that mean for you and the team?
I’m just thankful to be a part of something like this. It was a big commitment going over there for both sides, trusting each other. I think a lot of people would have said that was crazy, but what those guys proposed and how they said they were going to run this team and that they wanted to be the best of the best and that if there was a problem with the bike, that they’d be able to sort through it. I felt like we had the right guys that if something wasn’t working, we changed that. There were a lot of times we’d have to fix things here and there, but I felt like I had plenty of time to get the bike ready for 2012 and Anaheim 1. There are some things we learned along the way as far as the bike that I wish we would’ve known at the beginning, but I feel like the bike was strong. It was always solid. And being a part of a brand like this is really cool. They wanted more over here in America and to be a dominant manufacturer and to be on top and, to me, that’s about winning races and championships because that’s what I’m hired to do. And now, when I'm older or I'm done, I'll be able to one day leave and they can get whatever top rider they want. It’s proven now. I really feel like this year was a great start, great momentum, and I’m really excited because we have notes under our belt so we have a lot of direction and we can make things better for years to come, especially next year. I’m looking forward to the testing and to have everything set up for Monster Cup and des Nations.
There’s a lot of talk surrounding silly season right now. Do you know if KTM is looking for someone to train with you or join the team? Another 450 rider?
I think we were going after one guy, but he ended up signing with somebody else. At this moment, I don’t hear any talk. I think they’d like another 450 rider, but we’ll see how things turn out. But yeah, I’m not sure.
This is a brand new track to the national circuit. Did this one make its mark to show that it belongs in there?
Absolutely. With it being the first year, the layout of the facility was amazing. I think we all agree we were blown away by that. Attendance was good. I think it was just a really hot day, so people were hiding, but I think it was good. The dirt here is so rock hard and the dirt they brought in was good, but it seemed like at the end of the day, all the dirt they brought in was on the left or right side of the track and they were down to a pretty hard base and even that wasn’t sketchy or anything like that. I had a lot of fun. The track was really long, very choppy and rough. But I think it belongs in the series. It was a good race, a successful day and a good stop.
Next stop is the Motocross of Nations for Dungey.
Simon Cudby photo
Watching you and Mike [Alessi] go at it in the second moto, that looked like one of the more aggressive battles you’ve had this year.
Yeah, it was good. Mike put up a great fight all year. It was good racing him; there were a lot of good battles there. Second moto, I had some extra ground to make up, for sure, and he was riding really good today. Once I got behind him, there were some points where I almost ran right into the back of him, put us both in a weird spot. But he was just trying to protect his insides and he rode really good. It was great to race a guy like that all year. You’ve got to be on top of your game and focus and be ready.
What's your schedule now? I know you said you’re going to Europe early to prepare for the Motocross of Nations. What’s the schedule and how far in advance are you going to get there?
We land over there on the 19th and the race is on the 30th. We’re going to go over and ride the track we’re racing on one day and whether we can get a little bit better in the sand or not, we get three or four days of riding, so that’ll be nice. It’s better than flying over like two days before and you’re sleeping for those two days and stuff like that. So we get to get adjusted and everything and then ride. Austria’s close by, so with the KTM manufacturer coming out, we know we can make the changes necessary and we’ve got days to test and just get comfortable. The guys who run the sand over there are going really good at this moment, so I hope we’ve got something for them. I really feel like we’ve got a great team and being consistent is the most important thing, not being the one-man hero. But it would be nice to put an end to all the talk. You know how it is. It's unnecessary. So, yeah, it’d be great to go over there and put on a great show and put up a good fight for all three of us.
Dungey celebrates his tenth straight overall at Lake Elsinore.
Simon Cudby photo
Have you ever been to Belgium? Your guy Roger DeCoster is from there, so will you get a tour of where he used to live?
I’ve never been to Belgium. My first time out of the States was – not counting Canada – Italy in 2009 and then France last year. It’ll be interesting. We have time over there to kind of look around and things. With Roger [Decoster], what he has said is that basically that there isn’t anything left that anybody hasn’t said. We’ve been hearing about the track and stuff, so there’s nothing we haven’t heard about. We hear it’s rough. It’s going to be a challenge. It’s going to be a physically tough for sure. I’m interested. It’s a new experience, get out and experience and new track and everything.
You ever ridden a sand track like that?
I grew up on a sand track. My grandfather owned 22 acres, and it was sugar sand, it was really rough and whooped out all the way. I rode it all the time until I was probably 15. It was fun, I like the sand, so I'm really excited to go over there and put some time in. Sometimes, we don't ride sand for so long that it takes some time to get your groove back, so I'm excited to get over there and start working on it.
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"Stanton's jeolous that I blew by his win record" RD
what a class act can't wait to have him show Herlings whats up :)
The new KTM is a great bike, too.
I wonder if Alessi would have been as close if he didn't cut the track several times.
Cut the track? I didn't see tthat
I'm curious who the other rider they were talking to was. Rattray or Tickle maybe? I hope Baggett has some desire left in the tank for MXoN.
HAHA, Stanton things Baggett, Barcia and Tomac can beat Dungey, now thats funny.
Didn't Stanton always complain of getting no respect?
I hope that Blake is out for redemption! Actuality, the last great 250 ride @ mxdn we had was 08 by Rv ( 07 was the gnarliest ride by anyone ever). 09 Weimer had problems, 10 canard had problems, 11 blake had problems. Lets hope that bad luck steak comes to an end! Bad luck seems to be chasing a lot of riders@mxdn. Take Cairoli for example... 09 he was killing it and then gnarly crash came... Lets go USA!
Not4show - In SX, Barcia was very close to Dungey's speed. Baggett & Tomac have shown signs of being faster than Barcia. They're all pretty close. So, that comment doesn't really seem like much of a stretch. With all the hungry talent we're going to have next year, Dungey is going to need really good starts, or get really aggressive with his passing. Otherwise, there's going to be more than his fair share of fifth place finishes. That's obviously with the assumption that everyone stays healthy, which they won't...
meankx-Blakes problems last year were the track, he is going to have the same problems this year. As fasr as 07 gnariliest ever, I"m not so sure, there were a few rides when guys on 125's beat the 500 for the moto. But RV in 07 was darn close to those.
corndog--close and signs don't equal wins. I won't argue that Dungey would run the table against these guys, but he would come out ahead more often then not. And you talk like Dungey didn't win MX/SX races when all the "TOP" guys were there.
All the TOP riders get all this respect and yet Dungey who has missed 3* races in the last 5 years get none. So tell me why doesn't he? He has a SX lites title MX lites title, 1 SX Title and 2 MX titles, you don't get all those by luck. And oh year he is only 22yo's
@not4show,
The problem is some people do not understand that you get points for being there and scoring points. Dungey was and is the best rider on the track every time he won a championship! My favorite rider is RV i feel that he is the fastest rider in the world! But Dungey beat him in every national this year look at the points he is the champion. You have to be in it to win it. Injuries, crashes are part of this sport and that is why the champion is the person who gained the most points over the season. Just like Larry the cable guy says "You can't fix stupid!"
@Not4show-You forgot to add that he is also 3rd on the all time win list. At his age, that alone is incredible. There are no gifts or asterisks in Motocross. There is some "luck of the draw" involved, but to the best of my knowledge, that isn't anything that can be controlled. And we all know that the Dunge has had his share of bad luck, along the way. Which, once again, adds to his credibility. Yes, I'm a Dungey fan. It's hard not to be. I am a fan of all racers, past and present. They have truly entertained me. Gotta love moto!!!
@not4show and mit12 well said...
Three quotes I liked from his interview
". But it would be nice to put an end to all the talk. You know how it is. It's unnecessary. So, yeah, it’d be great to go over there and put on a great show and put up a good fight for all three of us."
"With Roger [Decoster], what he has said is that basically that there isn’t anything left that anybody hasn’t said. We’ve been hearing about the track and stuff, so there’s nothing we haven’t heard about. We hear it’s rough. It’s going to be a challenge. It’s going to be a physically tough for sure. I’m interested. It’s a new experience, get out and experience and new track and everything"
" grew up on a sand track. My grandfather owned 22 acres, and it was sugar sand, it was really rough and whooped out all the way. I rode it all the time until I was probably 15. It was fun, I like the sand"
This Kid is Hungry...reminds me of Henry - not always the fastest buthas unmatched desire....
There is no way that was Dungey LOL. He actually gave answers that informed us of things. And they were a paragraph long. Thanks Ryan, that was the first interview worth reading. Glad he won the 'ship.
@mit12-Been wondering for a while. Now today I will type it. mit12-is that at all political? I mean presidential? Pretty sure it's a coincidence, but you gotta understand my asking! lol
"But it would be nice to put an end to all the talk. You know how it is. "
.NICE!!! Nice to hear RD say somthing like that!!
Bucky CARFUL!! don't say stuff like that, Tonewall will give u a beat down if every word you type is not moto related!!
.LOL how ya been anyway?? You Have not been here much lately.
RD better bring it good if he want to win a moto over the EURO'S!! I don't see him crashing to win a moto cuz he is to smart but to say that going to that track is BOLD!!
Whys everyone so mad ?
@bucky394,
What do you mean by "is that political? I mean presidential?"
In this case it is just facts.
I do have a little fun with the JS lovers they are real easy to excite. They think I am a hater but that is not the case.
Not4show - Sorry, I don't mean to sound like Dungey hasn't beaten the best straight up. I'm just saying that there's going to be even more riders in the premier class next year that are very close to Dungey's speed. That's going to make starts and aggressive passing even more critical than it was last year. That's all I was trying to say.
@mit12 I think he meant your name...it could be looked at as Mit Romney 2012...
@yz chris 76 people have been cutting the track all summer long - not just Alessi.
In typical AMA fashion they wait till the last minute to address it....
Wow RD is a nice guy my reply to this question would of been much different. "Watching you and Mike [Alessi] go at it in the second moto, that looked like one of the more aggressive battles you’ve had this year."
My reply:
"Well you have to be careful, he'll block and move over on you while flipping you off then if does sneak a win in he'll try and hug you like you guys are pals"
In yesterdays 250 words I thanked the guys in that class for putting out such great effort and bringing us an exciting race at each stop of the Great Outdoors, today it is the 450 riders turn....To Ryan, the Locomotive, Dungey congrats on another title!! Your nose to the grindstone work ethic is some thing to behold, as your workman style has brought you amazing success, you deserve all the accolades you receive!! To Mike Alessi, you went along way in restoring your credibility as a top rider, you rode with desire and the never say die attitude it takes to be successful. You impressed me and a lot of other fans and we wish to thank you giving us nothing but your best each time out. Thanks to Weimer Short, TIckle, Grant, Brayton, Chisholn, and Milsaps, you all showed us how to find that inner strength and fight through the adversity that can get in the way of attaining your goals. None of you ever gave up, you kept pressing forward, your perseverance is inspiring, it is a lesson we fans can use in our everyday lives. To all the rest of the guys who lined up and sacrifice so much, for so little return, in order to live the moto dream, a sincere THANK YOU, as you are the life blood of the sport! Last but not least, to all the guys who were injured and unable to compete or finish the series, we the fans would like to wish you a speedy recovery and to let you know you were missed and your efforts were not in vain!! We fans appreciate everyone's efforts in this years edition of the Great Outdoors!!!
I think KTM was trying to get wilson, I can't remember where I read that or who said it or if it's even credible but I do remember reading that somewhere
Corndog don't worry we're cool, I don't think anyone can completely dominate without a little luck on their side. I mean Even BILLC gave Dungey a little compiment, now thats something!!!
As far as MXdN, I think Dungey will be 2nd to Cairoli, Baggett 4th in class and Barcia 2nd(herlings) in class for MX3, of course all those predictions are based on No big crashes and a half decent start.
Hey Billc you still cryin about a week ago....sorry..its not near the worst thing I've ever said or done so give it a rest and get off my lawn..politics on a moto site still continues to SUCK.......my call is Dungey will crush all comers at the dez nations like commie bugs...signed RV2 fan....and his to sidekicks Bam Bam and 'the man who fell to earth' will do damage while making lots of friends along the way........@mit12 i agree with your 1st comment exactly... also Mikey would need to cut about a 1/4 mile of track to beat Dungey....no disrespect intended.......
@tonewall your right Dungey is going to wreck any compitition with blake and justin with him USA is goinig to dominate! lets go U.S.A!
For those that like stats: MX 2011, Dungey beat RV in 11 motos. Dungey was leading at Freestone moto, ahead of RV by a country mile, when his bike quit resulting in scoring of 0 points. Which "IF" it hadn't would have put them even on moto finishes.
So, luck goes both ways sometimes in Dungeys Favor sometimes not. But with those stats, I say its a 1 moto score toss up between RV and Dungey for the next 3 years on the championship.
With the Reliability of the KX and KTM, hopefully these boys stay healthy and it will be a barn burner to the last moto every year.
AHHHH Isn't bench racing so much fun.
@dinosaurmedia
Boy I would have never put that together. Mit12 is my name backwards and my racing number, it was a nickname given to me way back in the late 70's early 80's by Goat Breakers dad.
mit12----now thats funy right there.
see folks, just see stuff for what it is, not everyone is a activist!!!!
i seen an interview with Dean Wilson, who said KTM was courting him. that's probably the one guy.
Eurozozos - That's not entirely true, those just happen to be the next fastest guys who didn't crash out. This year, Dungey was the only guy to maintain that level of speed without hurting himself.
BD25 - great post , I agree !
BD25 - great post , I agree !
You peeps talk like Dungey has never ridden or even heard of the des Nations before. He'll do just fine, thank you. Re: 2nd KTM rider. They were trying to work a deal out with me, and I agreed to most of their demands, but I insisted they let me use my CR250R. They wouldn't go for it.
YA BD25 your posts are always good! ty
Now what I had trouble with the interview was one thing--- Without DeCoster it would never have happened, Give Roger the credit he deserves! The guy is a great man! The few times I talked to him he was always very polite and joked about stuff also.There is a reason they call him "The Man"
Not4show I give RD props a lot, He IS one of the BEST in the World!! My only complant is I wish he could pass better. It will be very hard next year if he does not get better at it in SX mostly. Hell you could have a real good night and get 6th next year!! If RD holeshots he is hard to beat but if he gets a bad start next year with 8 fast guy out there he could lose a lot of points some night's. They all will be getting some 5th's and 6th's maybe!! Could be a great year!!.
.Tonewall just having a little fun is all!!
Great competition next year in the 450s with the addition of the injured plus Wilson, Barcia, and Tomac. Yes I said Tomac, because he will be too big for a 250F next year. As for the Nations, its a lock for America, nuff said.
Roger is the man because when he tells you to bend over you always ask how far .......LOL Welker
@ORU don't try to lay your fantasy on us....bro.....your on your own with that one....
tonewall
GOT IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!! All kidding aside moto wouldn't be the same without Decoster ,and thats a fact !
Are you guys high? Comparing Dungey to Stanton is ridiculous. Dungey is struggling to get around a privateer rider on a stock bike! When Dungey beats a full field of factory riders, top level, then let's talk. I'm not saying he's not great.. But he has had a blessed cakewalk of a career so far.
The only person that's measures up to Stanton is Carmichael.. So you people let that go!
Alessi cutting the track? RD was off the track alot more than Alessi. He even rode inside the banners cutting an entire corner. I really don't care and don't think it affected the outcome, but it's funny how people pick and choose when to make it an issue.
Moto-cross of Nations 2013 will be at RED BUDD
rickamatuzio,
Alessis bike is anything but stock. Heck, it doesn't even have yellow fenders.
Also, Alessis engine builder was boasting how he does custom camshafts for a smoother Torque curve, and that he gets 60++++ HP out of it. Yeah thats not a stock bike. Considering Dungey beat Alessi 22 out of 24 motos this year I would say that he didn't have a whole lot of trouble with him
As far as comparing Dungey to Stanton, I don't think anyone was doing that. Alot of guys commented on how STANTON said the top 3 Americans could beat Dungey. And innuendoed that Dungey only won the title because, RV and Reed were while Stewart got hurt during the season and didn't finish.
But my comments were how everyone back then Said Stanton only won because, so and so got hurt and handed the titles over......So to me its the pot calling the kettle black.
Anyone who wins a title earns,
There is a young man named Ryan
When he gets on a bike he starts fly'n
And when they think he is beat
He just sits on the seat
And calculates how to get by them
Not4Show
You won't be so loud when RV JS CR come back and waste your boy in supercross, quit acting like Dungey is the moto god, he had no competition this year and when he did he didn't win, that's a fact you can't disagree with because it's true. RV was sick last year at the beginning of the nationals for quite awhile and had bike issues, but towards the end when RD needed to beat him he couldn't. Sorry but you are a show, Dungey fans will go back to being quiet instead of Douche Bags like you talking crap about other riders who are going to yard him in supercross, just like after 2010 when the competition came back and no one was talking about him, and why weren't they talking about him? Because they were talking about villo and stewart who were winning races and yarding him.
Cairoli and Herlings at the MX Des Nations?
And if everyone is healthy in 2013, the 450 SX and MX classes will be epic.
Alessis bike is a production bike. Every part of it can be bought by the consumer. He has a PRODUCTION shock which is a huge disadvantage. He has production forks. Motor mods.. And yes, apparently very special and sleek black plastic that makes the bike better. Did you watch Washougal? I have no doubt Alessi is good for 1sec a lap on a FACTORY BIKE and Dungey may loose a few races.
Dungey is awesome, he grew up 2 hours from me and we raced as kids. I am in his corner, I think he will prove he is the best AGAINST the best eventually.. But so far his 450 career has been easy picking. Cherry picking. Cherry farming..
Whatever you want to call it.
There is something to be said for always being healthy. McGrath was the same way.. But there arent 6 full factory riders battling anymore. The sport is in a sad state today.. And I hope to Christ other people are as bored watching 4 stroke freight train racing like me. It sucks.
Stanton won thru multiple generations, bayle wasnt hurt. Bradshaw wasn't hurt. Cooper, Ward, and all other champions. Johnson is the only one that got hurt that I remember.
By the way, Baggett Barcia and Tomac run the same lap times as Dungey on little bikes. Not a big deal.. But that's not historically the case.
It's weird that when the MX2 guys had better lap times than the MX1 guys some experts used to talk crap about GP's. This year that happened very often in the National and these experts disappeared, probably they didn't notice it, I don't know.
The cutting the track deal sorta went out the window when Dungey rather consistently couldn't keep it between the stakes in the 2nd moto. I'm sure there were plenty of other riders doing it too.
Just a couple things..I think we would all agree that Villopoto - Dungey - Stewart- Reed are on the level above the rest regardless of who you root for...so with that said...
In persona's comment, he is guilty of what so many accuse Dungey fans of, making excuses...First Villopoto was sick, then he was having bike trouble, both of which are true. Just as it is true, RD experienced bike issues, having run out of fuel and his bike not showing up at the line, both of which effected Dungey's confidence. While RV was full of comfort and confidence Dungey was running low on both and many riders have said, confidence is key to going fast. All excuses aside, as a Dungey fan I agree with persona, he did not win when he needed to, so I credit Villopoto, he won the championship, after a great season of battling Dungey. Outdoors the two Ryans, are in my eyes, the best two riders in the world. On any given race day they will push each other to the next level, gapping the rest of the field, as we saw then do many times last year.
This year with Villopoto out, Stewart was going to be the one to raise the bar for Dungey to match. At Hangtown and Freestone, we got to see great racing, as James lead the way, Ryan was right there, shadowing his rear fender, matching Stewarts speed, as they gapped the field. It is a shame James got hurt and we did not get to witness those two go at it for all 12 rounds. I am sure they would have traded wins and produced a spectacular season in the Great Outdoors. Once James went out, Alessi did his best and dueled with Ryan at times, but the ever calculating RD, took his time and picked his spots to ride away from Mike. Alessi could contend but not push Dungey to ride at the next level.
So again, this year, Dungey and his fans, will have to listen to those who say he had no competition for the title.Truth be told, the only other 3 guys who have proved to be on his level, where missing from competition. The same could be said of the 08 champion Stewart, as when he went 24-0, the only rider on his level had retired, while Reed had a supercross only contract. The 09 champion, Reed did not have Stewart to contend with, leaving him to easily take the title. This is repeated through out the history of moto, one or two dominant riders among many talented riders. Rick brought up Stanton, who won a lot titles, he benefited from RJ's injury, Ward being old, Bradshaws mental weakness and Bayle going back to Europe to road race. If you want you can sit an nit pick almost any ones championship, but rather than do that why not give credit to the rider for what they have achieved...Winning a championship at their level requires a lot of talent, hard work, dedication and sacrifice, all qualities to admire, mixed with a little luck to put them over the top.. I say to who ever wins the championship, Congratulations you earned it!!!!
On to supercross...
Every rider has their own strengths and skill set, some feel more comfortable outdoors riding motocross, while others prefer the confines of an indoor supercross track. Some riders are equally at ease on either, such as Villopoto, who seems to ride both with the same aggressive style. He is by far he favorite going into 2013 supercross season with Stewart and Reed close behind. Dungey who is the least aggressive of the top four will rely on his consistency to stay in the title hunt. Wilson and Barcia will have their moments but will find the long season tough to contend with since they have only raced half the season thus far being in the lites division..I just hope that motocross's ugly sister, supercross, will not harm as many riders as last year!! I would like to see them all healthy and lined up when the gate drops on the Great Outdoors of 2013!!!!!
Sorry to have rambled on so much, just wanted to give my two cents worth, but I gave you all a dollars worth...
Get over it persona, if you can't stay healthy and keep it on two wheels consistently then your speed means nothing. Count his titles/wins vs his age and keep telling yourself he's not as good as the other guys. Speed and aggression are only a fraction of the equation of winning championships, and RD is doing just fine. I take it you're an RV fan since you listed him first each time you referenced the other guys, but you sound like a JS fan.
As it's been said before, depending who you're a fan of you can find excuses to asterisk the sh*t out of every title anyone has earned. But the cool part of racing is there is no excuses, the title holder is the champion, the BEST guy at that given time and series. Injuries are part of racing, using your head and riding within yourself are part of racing. RD is just as good as anyone else, each guy has their strengths and weaknesses. Title count is the only fair measure.
Thats why in Dungeys rookie year on big bikes, he was fighting RV for the championship, RV needed to win and instead crashed out, because he couldn't handle the pressure of Dungey.
rickamatuzio,
Alessi has had factory bikes, he wasn't faster on them. Actually he did worse excepts for the year he finished 2nd to Stewart.
Do you really thing that Ohlins hasn't custom built stuff for Alessis bike? You seem pretty brainwashed that it was all Dungeys fault. Actually Alessi and Dungey were on the same bikes for Suzuki at Dungey outrode Alessi then. Oh well, get over Dungey is 2012 MX Champ.
RV is an amazing rider, but he didn't wasn't a champ his rookie year of MX or SX.
In SX he was a Distance 6th, behind JS, Reed, Grant Short & Windham.
As far as RV and MX, he has been on big bikes for 4 years and has only raced 1 year of MX.
@persona--Its funny that you mention Stewart in your post, Dungey has beaten him straight up in supercross the past 2 years, dont dont throw his nmae in there.. And RV had to give it all he had and passed Dungey on the last turn for a win in Steel City.. So Dungey is real freaking fast dude..
@Preston--You still belive that?? Stewie got 4th place in 2011 in supercross after racing all rounds, and hid for outdoors from RV and Reed, and finished way back in supercross again, and decided to race rght after RV went down.. Stewie is nowhere hear the fastest out there...And you say "when he keeps it on 2 wheels, that has been a problem LATELY"!!!! Really --lately, he has crashed his entire career... How m,any seasons did he crash out of?? Do the math.. Stewtard!!!
Stewart almost has as many MX races in the last 4 years has RV, thats kind of funny.
To me Dungey and RV are the two best riders in the US. In Europe you have Cairoli. Unless one of those riders is willing to take the chance(and money) and swap continents we will never see a dream season of those guys going at it.
To many factors go into the 3 Motos of MXdN to try and say anyone person is the fastest in the world.
RV has proven many times he can handle the pressure from everyone- not just RD. In 2010 he spunout on the concrete between jumps and dragged pegs up the face and broke his legs, had nothing to do with pressure. Not an excuse just fact. I would go so far to say that the more pressure you put on him the better he performs. I give RV a slight edge over RD when it comes to handling pressure, but its very close and very debatable.
Both these guys handle pressure extremly well and they way they ride is pure speed ,stamina and skill. Both are great sportsmen with great control. Both have very different styles, and both are great leaders for our sport. Both probably lack a little charisma for some but do their job better than everyone else at this point.
Listen, I am not cutting Dungey down and I agree with BD25 whole hearted. Are you guys not understanding that JOHN DOWD 20 years past his prime broke the top 10?? And mike brown got a top 6 having not raced an outdoor national all year!!! Come on folks.. The talent level is disappointingly low. That's why riders like windham can ride into their mid 30s competitively. Stanton retired at age 26!!!! Along with all the other greats.
Moto isn't where it should be. I have my opinions why.. But nobody would agree anyway.
At least nicholetti, who was nowhere near Baggett, or the top 10 showed up on a big bike for a top 5. What the??? Figure it out.
And Alessi was beating everyone including villipoto on his factory Suzuki before he torqued his knee. He won the first 3 races easily when David Baliey said he looked like a navy seal, remember? Alessi was scary fast.
Get a life folks its over worry next year Go bang Billc or your old ladies or your boy friends..............LOL
@ giftedFromGod Stick to your day job porn stash !
Maybe mike larocco should come out of retirement. He would probably podium.
The most frustrating part of the season is 4 strokes follow the leader. No bar banging.. Outside lines.. Rhythms.. Boring. In stantons days the tracks were gnarly rough.. They didn't take shovels and fix ruts In supercross.. And riders werent pampered. Things were tougher guys. I used to live for mx. I dreamt about it.. Since the 4 stroke age I have lost interest completely. I can't put my finger on why the racing sucks.. But watch a tape from 92 and you will understand. You will be glued to the tv. Davey Coombs is the man, I wished he could use his pull and fight for the return of two stroke racing. Heck, even I would come out of retirement and renew my pro card.
God help the sport.. Please. I want it back the way it was.
radish the Isl retard from Iraq who hates Europeans and who is hated by all the Americans: burn in hell dumbass, your brain is as big as a grain of sand and this is a compliment, get the hell out of here mentally retarded piece of crap
Rick I appreciate your passion for the sport, something we share.. I don't blame the 4 stroke, since we saw great racing in the 250 class this year and in the 450 class last year... and as a rider they are easier to control..I was around in the 70's on into the 80's thru the 90's and have seen the changes in our sport...the tracks still get rough but suspension is so much better...they have changed some of the natural stuff in favor of jumps or whoops to play to the TV audience, just as they dress it up for the cameras...In the 450 class the field may seem watered down but I think that is because of it has to do with injures we saw this year....at different times as many as 10 top riders missing from action and from a quick glance only Dungey scored points in every moto, every one else suffered a dnf or was injured...or could not afford to make all the races...I for one would like to read your thoughts on it
@Preston--thats all you got because you know what I wrote was correct..
yeah its so boring you come onto racerx to talk about it. lol get real you two stroke guys need to let it go already you guys feel like you arent connected to the sport or something because you choose to ride two strokes? they are never coming back into pro racing! get over it the guys in charge know what they are doing...........4strokes are better than 2 strokes,fuel injected is better than carburated...............
the less agressive or "bar banging" racing has nothing to do with the bike but more so the AMA rules, team owners, sponsers,and worst of all you internet critics that bash guys like barcia for doing the very thing you are complaining about missing
Well I can see I'm wasting my time when I read stuff like "4 strokes are better". Better at what??? I have been in r&d at an oil company for 10 years testing oils and blowing up engines. A two stroke is a FAR superior racing engine. Lighter, less rotating mass, fewer parts, cheaper to build, easier to fix, cheaper to operate, and makes twice the power per cc of a 4 stroke engine.
The AMA screwed up moving to 4 strokes in two ways. One, it tripled the cost of operation and basically in Minnesota the sport has dropped in 2/3 attendance. 400 riders at millville Instead of 1100 8 years ago. I rebuild these bikes for people... Kids can't afford the sport anymore. Most fathers can't either. It's terrible..
Two strokes making a tremendous difference in racing. It's a more nimble bike. That's why the 250f class is night and day different than 450.. The bikes are heavy freight trains.. The lines change.. The ability to stop changes.. Blocking... Obstacle difficulty.. It ALL CHANGES. Anyone that's ridden understands. It's easier to come in hot and make moves on a smaller lighter bike.
The AMA allowed DOUBLE the displacement to make 4 strokes even competitive. 1100$ for exhaust.. Heavy.. Powerful bike that's resulted in the worst injury laden seasons we have ever seen. Ya, 4 strokes are better. For trail riding at best. Should we try diesels next? They are even torquier.
I believe 2 strokes will make a return someday.. I really do. As people realize the truth. In 1980 amsoil saw this problem coming and offered a 100:1 oil to prevent a false theory that SMOKE from the exhaust means pollution. Not the case..
I could go on and on..
Watch some old races, and believe me. It makes a difference.
Rick ...every opinion matters, your not wasting your time..you make some good points..Lighter is better..$1200 exhaust systems..repair costs for privateers and the displacement issue, the 450's are a handful with all that power..that is why I ride a 250, I might like to try a 350..I enjoy the tractability of the 4 stroke and the more controllable power ...as for maintenance, I ride an 08 and have never had any engine problems, only cost I am out is oil and filters, where a 2 stroke I would have had to rebuild it a couple of times...as for the racing being better..last year RD and RV put on a great show outdoors..in 2011 supercross was also a great show of racing, unfortunately this year the racing was effected by all the injures...due to the 4 stroke..maybe some but RV's was not..The overall economy has hurt the racing industry as much as any thing, its hard for dad to take off work, every aspect of travel has gone up and gas prices reach close to $4 a gallon..Whats best for the our sport, I don't claim to know, I just trust in those who know more than I ..and that is just about everyone ....lol....Thanks for sharing your opinion with us ...
Well we are just scratching the surface here.. Your right, however your 08 450 will have a failure trust me. The question is how catastrophic. It will be a very expensive repair opposed to a 2 stroke. 1 piston a year for a cr250 is 150$.. I rode one to a state championship in 99 here in Minnesota 250a. 450s eat sprockets, chains, and other consumables more often.. I like the 350 idea. I was talking to Craig decker an hour ago and he said he would love the class to be capped at 350 as Injuries would be way down and racing would be tighter. He is a 4 stroke fan, but agrees the racing is dull because of it to a degree.
It just doesn't make sense.. Racing needs to be done on a budget!! The economy is down but the price of bikes and fixing them is a far superior problem. I have talked repeatedly to motocross shops and sponsors about this!! My friend blew up his new 450 TWICE this year and it was 2500$.
I promise you, if car enthusiasts could have two stoke engines opposed to four strokes they would be exactic about it for drag racing!! Faster, cheaper, simpler.. Win win.
We need Dave's Coombs to help with this. Lower displacements, or try to push back to 2 strokes realizing the EPA was completely misled. I have documents amongst documents of pollution resulting from motors and origins. It makes no sense! It was political.. Not environmental to make this move in the industry.
As far as the lack of talent in the sport, I must refer to my hero Stanton. These kids have it easy with person trainers and big salaries. They aren't self motivated to put on their running shoes and succeed. The incentive is lost except for a few it seems. I don't know... I know Im more of a motor head than psychologist but something needs to change cause we are headed the wrong way in motocross once the amateur side of the sport is lost.
I didnt mean lack talent. I mean lack of motivation and incentive. Kids today don't have the Doug Henry DESIRE. I believe Barcia does.. Iove that. It ate him up to lose.. He wasnt thanking sponsors for 3rd place.. He was pissed he got beat and wanted off the podium to get back to work. Amen
Rick .. I figure by saving the $150 for 4 years I will have $600 to upgrade with a big bore kit when my 08 250 breaks. I use to say the same as you, loyal to the 2 stroke, until I rode a 4 stroke...I am faster, more confident on my RMZ 250 than I was on my RM 250..granted I am not a pro speed guy, but the 4 stroke is easier for me to ride... I would have no problem with capping the class at 350 or 400cc that makes good sense..Racing should be done on a budget, but it never has been, racers have been throwing money at their machines since the start of racing...I have a issue of Supermotocross from 89 where an article tells how the high cost of motorcycles ($4000) and gear will ruin the sport, 23 years later bikes have doubled in cost, but so has every thing else we buy...so to me that is all a wash...As for the desire of the riders, there are some out there who still have the desire and they will rise to the top..but very few ever had the desire of Doug Henry, as he is one of a kind.. I thought the day of everyone having a big salary was gone, from what I understand some riders are riding for free just to have a gear deal or get the exposure....Your hero Stanton was a good guy, I talked him many times in 88 and 89...I was photographed with him, as we talked sitting on a hay bale after he won the 89 Supercross title in OKC, the next week Cycle News ran that picture...Jeff signed it for me and it is one of my moto treasures...Your passion shows thru and it has been a pleasure chatting with you ....time for me to call it an evening ...
Ok.. However.. There are a few fathers that will take a second mortgage out against their house and bankrupt their family in hopes that his kid will be the next star. But at the amateur level, it's not reality. Racing is done on a budget definitely.
Your 4 banger is easier to ride is my point. Kids today want to take the easy way out constantly.. I am telling you that a two stroke bike will MAKE you a better rider. It will enhance your corner speed.. You learn better hand, foot, eye coordination.
From a racers standpoint a four stroke makes no sense to me. From a consumers standpoint maybe it does.
Facts are facts.. Our sport is receding rapidly. Why? Economy? Maybe a little.. What other element changed? The COST. Why? Having 1500$ failures.. Half the cost of the bike to fix
I have attended Ponca City many times over the years, it always amazed me how many people, have high dollar motor homes and big rigs to haul their 3-6 motorcycles, parts, tires and gear, so far to stay a week and race, only to then move on to Loretta's for another week...When they left Ponca, swimming pools, ice chests, bbq grills, slightly used tires and just about any thing else you can image was left behind, as they did not have room to carry the stuff bought and used in Ponca City..These are all amateurs and Ponca is a small race compared to Oak Hill or Freestone Mini O's and such, their budget for racing must be huge!!
Racers will spend what ever it takes to race. Today's race bikes are mostly race ready for the general public right off the floor. No need to speed any more on aftermarket stuff, yet some will spend the $1200 on a pipe to gain 3-4 horse power or $250 on cams or $500 on head work all of which gain you a little power, but decrease reliability...To me the best money I spent on my RMZ 250 was the $400 to have the suspension revalved, that made me faster by keeping my rear wheel hooking up, increased my comfort and confidence, which helped my corner speed..
I do agree with you racing has gotten very expensive and there should be a place for the 2 strokes!! They are cheaper to maintain and do help you learn a lot of riding skills. Unfortunately, I don't see the factories who have spent so much time and money on the R&D of the 4 stroke ever going back to racing the 2 stroke as their premier machine.. I have heard Reed and Carmichael both tout how superior the bikes are today, which leads me to believe they will continue to be the future..Does racing need to make adjustments to breathe life back into itself..Yes...Will it be the revitalizing of the 2 stroke ...Maybe, but it will take the strong persistence and input from intrepid persons such as your self to bring things full circle....I respect all of your opinions and agree with a lot of what you say, I defiantly wish you the best of luck in your quest to save the 2 stroke and racing as you see it ...
As a 2 stroke and 4 stroke owner that quit on the brink of turning pro (point being I know how to ride a mx bike even though I just ride for fun now), any form of serious racing has always been about performance and nothing else. There are budgets, but it's always about being faster at all costs for those who are striving to be the elite. Bottom line is, today's 4 strokes are leaps and bounds superior to 2 stroke machines performance wise. Just because a 250 2-stroke makes more peak power on the dyno doesn't mean it's a better race bike than a 250F. I love riding my 250 2-stroke, but when I compare things like traction out of the gate and on the track, torque, and overall rideability across all different track conditions, it doesn't hold a candle to modern 4 strokes. They're simply better working machines if you're serious about going the fastest.
And it's not about us younger generations being lazy on the bike just because "it's easier" to go fast on. It's simply evolution, all aspects of life and technology advance forward to improve the quality of whatever product it is. Without the advancement of bikes to where they are now, the riders would still be going half the speed they are now like in the late 80's. You can't stop a competitive sport from evolving, without 4-strokes, personal trainers, etc, the sport wouldn't be at where it is now.
Well said sir...if not for the evolution of the sport, I would still think my 74 TM125 to a great bike!!! Things have progressed so far in technology, now to hop up your bike all you need is a lap top and you can have a custom power curve..I agree things are expensive, but in retrospect, racing always has been, as racers will spend what ever it takes to gain an advantage....
Evolution? A CR250 in 1990 made the same horsepower a 2007 did. A 2005 Honda 450 makes the same power a 2013 does. We arent reinventing the wheel here! What % of Amatuer racers Do you think make it to Ponca?! It's less than 1%. The average weekend Motocross racer is who I am speaking for.. Not a dean Wilson team green rider that has 15000$ bikes.
I promise you, as the sport evolves itself into a financial scrutiny, and injury laden show..like its doing, we will look back and wonder where we went wrong.
Don't mix my words up.. I said a two stroke is unquestionably a far superior race engine because of power output and COST and WEIGHT. If you dont think so, you looking at it biased. I have a 450.. I am a motörhead.. Try to look at things from afar..
Imagine lifting a 4 stroke chain saw over your head that's 40 pounds heavier and a 2lb flywheel. Good luck.. It's what makes sense.
4 strokes only evolved for ONE REASON!! The EPA WAS MISLED ABOUT TWO STROKE EMISSIONS!! And because they suck so bad, they allowed double displacement. Then run them on the edge of destruction to be competitive..
Speaking of evolution, where would it be today? How do you know it wouldnt be WAY better than 4 stroke? You dont.. We are comparing 10 year old technology and it's STILL better.
Ponca at one time had around 2000 entries, it was down to about half of that this year. The NMA racing in OKC had 500 or so entries I was told. I am not talking of the Team Green riders either, when I spoke of the huge motor homes rigs and trailers...I don't know how they afford to do what they do...in years past the motor homes started getting lined up a week ahead of time, and the line would be a mile long...Ponca has lost a lot of its luster over the years but RPM Promotions did a good job this year...but that is off subject..I am not a motor head and I have never changed a piston or done any motor work, on any of the 30 or so motorcycles I have owned. I have never had a failure on any of them, lucky I guess!! I never got any faster than an int rider and now its the over 50 class for me....for my riding style the 4 stroke works better, and I do ok on my 250 against the 450,s...I appreciate your passion for the two stroke and hope you can make a diffidence, keep on fighting the good fight and stick to your beliefs!!
I think this is as far as it goes for me! Posting with you... It was fun.
I'm very sad.. My family has been in the oil business for 30 years and it was a sad day when 2 strokes went tits up. Amsoil spent tons of money on testing and development on the finest two stroke oil on the market. Seems like a waste now..
I know I don't have FUN riding my 450, but in order to try to race my all time rival BRUCE GATES, I would need a 450 to have a chance. I enjoyed racing two strokes much more.. It seemed different I can't explain it.
The four strokes will always been prone to valve train problems unfortunately.. With a dirty environment and high rpm.
Your right.. With the money Honda has spent, they won't want to go back.
I'm 39 years old now and past winning.. I would ride again for fun but I'm not interested in big heavy four strokes.
I hope someday the sport returns to when we had 1400 riders at Millville. Good times..
I know my opinion isn't dominant. Very few support me.. But given my resources and wealth of information and knowledge.. Plus huge experience.. I wished I could speak up more and ConvInce people.
I had the pleasure of working a little with mike larocco.. And I still work alot with Craig decker. Craig is SO smart, that I think he is going to come up with something special in the industry soon.. The man impresses me constantly. We have the same discussion you and I just had.. He doesn't agree with me on everything, except he does agree bigger faster bikes = Injuries and dull racing.
He agrees with me, him still being heavy in the industry, that we need to do something to bring the numbers back and make the sport great again. Maybe a better economy will help, but I stick to my opinion it's the cost of fixing a used blown up four stroke.
That's pretty much all I got
My first sentence didn't come out right. On my IPhone...
This as far as it goes meaning I won't discuss it with other people.
I enjoyed the discussion with you and that's where I pretty much end after we are done!
I'll end up back to reading the posts of bashing riders and whatever else!
Yes enjoyed the discussion, so many on here can not do that, as they get upset when someone disagrees with them...I am always open to others ideas, as I know I am not all knowing..as they say there are 3 sides to every story, yours, mine, and the truth..A lot of what you say holds merit, and you seem very intelligent, if you want to make a difference, do not stop here! Use your voice and Craig's access to the industry to reach more people...I think there is room for both.... I don't ride a 450 because of the weight and power, that is why I like the 250, it is fun to ride and does not wear me out...Hope you can make a difference, may be I will see you at Millville next year..I have attend it 12-14 times over the years as I always enjoy Spring Creek, I met Bucky, off these forums, there this year and will be staying in Zumbo Falls next year if things work out...Once again Good Luck,its been a pleasure!
rickamatuzio: Stanton was only the 3rd or 4th best rider inn his day and would be a class B rider today. Dungey would DESTROY him!
Notice how long this post is? I think some people are sceered of the Dunge......!
Rcrddw ... Stanton will find you, and when he does... He will crush you. You can run, but you cannot hide.
I think he left his house in Michigan in a full sprint yesterday, hes in such good shape he should arrive at your house in a few days, barely out of breath.
B rider.. 6 times. You have no wings, you have no prayer..
- red rider