by Chase Stallo
Bench Racing Ammo: Stewart vs. Dungey
Thursday, May 31, 2012 | 11:00 AM
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PrintIn this weeks Sign of the Lap Times feature we briefly touched on how amazing, brilliant, and down right remarkable James Stewart and Ryan Dungey were at Freestone. The two were unmatched as they galloped around the Lone Star State in a drag race to the finish in each moto. As previously noted in Sign of the Lap Times, not only were their fastest laps two (first moto) and three (second moto) seconds faster than the next closest competitor, their average lap times eclipsed the fastest lap set by anyone else!
Anytime you see such a battle, you’re naturally drawn into the stats, trying to find any and every correlation that may or may not have validity. But as you can see in the charts below, sometimes the barrel comes up empty. Stewart would fire down a quick lap, only to be matched by Dungey. Dungey would draw closer with a scorching time, only to be outdueled by Stewart a lap later. Each rider tried to make a run, find momentum and make a move, but each time, his competitor would match him, and the gap would stay the same! This was nothing more than a Texas standoff where Stewart fired first… and last.
Look at the chart below to see the full lap times from each rider in moto one and moto two. It doesn't get any closer!
*Bold: The fastest lap of the rider in each session.
Moto 1
| Lap | Ryan Dungey | James Stewart |
| 2 | 2.06.372 | 2.05.694 |
| 3 | 2.05.640 | 2.06.196 |
| 4 | 2.06.075 | 2.05.866 |
| 5 | 2.05.946 | 2.06.827 |
| 6 | 2.06.093 | 2.06.281 |
| 7 | 2.06.283 | 2.06.065 |
| 8 | 2.04.846 | 2.05.089 |
| 9 | 2.07.025 | 2.07.468 |
| 10 | 2.06.423 | 2.05.635 |
| 11 | 2.06.028 | 2.06.170 |
| 12 | 2.06.683 | 2.07.357 |
| 13 | 2.07.760 | 2.07.118 |
| 14 | 2.06.638 | 2.07.033 |
| 15 | 2.06.173 | 2.06.144 |
| 16 | 2.04.419 | 2.04.380 |
| 17 | 2.07.801 | 2.06.616 |
In moto one, Stewart got the drop early, making a pass on Dungey during the first lap, then building a small gap. Then Dungey found his groove and closed in on lap three, Stewart responded on lap four, prompting Dungey to log a flyer on lap five and six, so Stewart picked it up on lap seven, leaving Dungey to really pick it up on lap eight and log the first 2:04 of the race. From there, they exchanged fast laps, until lap 16, when they both dropped the hammer and logged their fastest times of the race. Dungey knew it was time to go, but so did Stewart, leaving them to both hit the 2:04 mark on the next-to-last lap. Incredible! Also note that, until the final lap when Dungey hit some traffic, they were within a second per lap on every lap!
Moto 2
| Lap | Ryan Dungey | James Stewart |
| 2 | 2.07.573 | 2.08.568 |
| 3 | 2.07.549 | 2.07.300 |
| 4 | 2.06.720 | 2.06.154 |
| 5 | 2.05.833 | 2.06.576 |
| 6 | 2.06.766 | 2.06.782 |
| 7 | 2.07.912 | 2.07.133 |
| 8 | 2.06.454 | 2.06.881 |
| 9 | 2.06.688 | 2.06.774 |
| 10 | 2.07.831 | 2.07.371 |
| 11 | 2.06.120 | 2.06.337 |
| 12 | 2.05.806 | 2.06.314 |
| 13 | 2.06.469 | 2.06.371 |
| 14 | 2.07.060 | 2.06.008 |
| 15 | 2.05.322 | 2.04.642 |
| 16 | 2.05.060 | 2.05.169 |
| 17 | 2.06.060 | 2.06.673 |
Similary story here to moto one, with both within a second on just about every lap. You can see Stewart went for one last crazy sprint on lap 15, but Dungey came right back with his best on lap 16, although Stewart kept the hammer down and matched that 2:05. All in all, an amazing duel. Hopefully we get to see it again!
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First moto can't be much closer as afr as speed, Moto 2 JS had a bigger gap. Either way VERY inpressive!! Fastest lap at the end shows how strong they are!!
"James Stewarts not in shape for outdoors" "Dungeys gonna smoke him".......hahah
Them dolts are long gone thetoothperry116. But just wait till RD wins won they will be here like flys on chit!!
For all the negative people, this is a bitter pill any way you look at it. Stewart looks every bit as fast as when he was in top form as the FMOTP. For the people that said he was out of shape and done, they were all wrong. For the people that said Dungey would have nothing for JS and the KTM deal was a bad move, also totally wrong.
The Freestone Motos were the best we have seen outdoors in along time. These two guys are flying. For the people who actually ride and race, JS and RD are a joy to watch.
Cat and Mouse = See Above Stats
While it has been mentioned many times, the difference here is Dungey not being able to make the pass and make it stick.....Dungey was on James, but any time he attempted to make a pass, James just clicked it up enough to stay ahead....What I want to see is, Dungey make the pass on James and see if he can make it stick or does James just click it up and pass him back and do the same thing we saw at Freestone.....To me, Dungey seemed to be working really hard to maintain that small gap, while James was riding calm and comfortable....We have seen Dungey make those late moto charges and pass RV and Reed like we saw last year at Freestone, but he was not able to do it.....But all that can change....bring on Colorado!!!
He could obviously click it up. As soon as Dungey showed him a fender he logged the fastest lap of the moto. Dungey was pretty impressive though, not gonna lie. If Stewart wasnt there he wouldve dominated.
Of course JS is gonna look more comfortable than Dungey, he didnt have a face full of roost for 30+2 and was also able to ride his own lines. While dungey was having to search for lines. Awsome performance by both riders. A true test of physical fittness
You got that right Bad Billy
I think the best is yet to come.
Indeed Bad Billy on a Hurricane..... However, if you want to ride your own lines and not eat roost all day, you need to make the pass the guy in front of you .....James made 4 or 5 passes in total on the day...during the first lap... 2 of those passes were made on Dungey.....so passing can be done....The "comfort" part I am talking about is James not making any mistakes like he usually does when someone (reed, RC, K-dub, anyone) is on his tail trying to make a pass or applying the "pressure" - Billy Joel style.....he looked very in control and ready to go faster if needed...bobbles, cruss ruts and loosing traction are not always a rider mistake, but more so just part of the outdoor racing game on a rough and challenging track.....Dungey seemed to make more mistakes by coming up short a few times, choosing bad lines when attempting too pass (read DV's column) etc....but he was on it....no doubt about that......My bet is if Dungey did make the pass, Stewart would have passed him right back.....hope these guys battle each week...run aways are ok once in a while....but not for 24 motos!!!
plain and simple.....the only way for Dungey to beat Stewart is to get agressive, trade some paint. As it is (and has already been said by many) Stewart does not even consider Dungey will get agressive, so he (Stewart) has nothing to fear.
The Dunge needs to create fear in his competitors in order to be able to pass them quickly. I don't think it is in his DNA to be agressive to the point of creating fear.....
Just my humble observation.
I really believe Stew is not acclimated yet and has not even hit his stride. I think he is riding reserved right now due to such a long lay off , and when he gets a few more weekends under his belt, I do not think Ryan is going to be able to see him much past the third lap. Just my thoughts, but I really think he isn't even in a groove yet.
Dungey needs to hire about 40 people to get on the practice track and try and blitz through them as fast as he can over and over and over again. He has trouble getting by the lapper squeeky clean like JS does. Didnt he actually run into the back of one in that shaded corner?
It can be argued that the season was over when Stewy announced his plans to race.
But I hope that debate is proven wrong by Dungey and/or others.
And the 250 class has been entertaining ... so far ....
Both of these guys are definately hauling a$$. I didnt think Stewart would be winning yet. Mostly because his lack of riding outdoors. New team or not, he knows the bike very well, owned one for over a year.
Dungey, i'm not sure. He needs to be more aggressive thats for sure, he has the speed, just lacking in the balls department a bit, i'd say it's because he knows Stewart has a habit of lawndarting and taking others with him, but he's always been this way since jumping to the premier.
Regardless it's good racing, and i hope they battle all the way. (Wish RV was here.....and Reed/Canard)
I hope Bagget takes it in the 250cc.
We'll see.
I was one to doubt James being in shape, I was wrong about that, but I never doubted his speed. He is a rare talent, no doubt he will go down as one of the greats. If this is the more mature James, he is saying all the right things,as he tries to repair his damaged reputation. I was one to doubt Dungeys speed, I was wrong about that, he stayed on James's fender for two motos while using differant lines to avoid as much roost as possible. At the end of the day JS said they were equal at Freestone.
As the season goes on, I think alot of rounds will resemble what we were treated to in Texas, close racing between the 7 an 5. I will be rooting for the 5 to take the title. James has had his time on top, I would like to see youth be served. Dungey, along with the injured Villopoto are the future legends of the our sport, but they can still learn from the current ones, Reed and Stewart!
cant wait till this weekend. dungey will smoke james at lakewood. Thats a place where dungey has an advantage. as long as that KTM isn't pogo sticking around like freestone
I still dont think dungey found his groove on the KTM yet, and i think stew is maxing it out, just my thought
I'm gonna disagree with that last comment OrganDoner...he's been on that bike more than enough to have it figured out. He just has to get out of that comfort zone.
If you love racing you got to be having fun watching these last 2 rounds, amazing display of ability and heart by these two. Now that being said, it does look to me like stewart is having an easyer time of going that fast. Dungy is really working to stay up there, that KTM imo isnt at the same level that Suzuki is, (obvious statement but still worth noting) sometimes Dungy would land and his head would stap forward, like it was a really hard hit, and his front end is just squirlly going into the corners, watch the bar ends, they are all over the place, very erratic looking, Stewart on the other hand looks very stable. I think if KTM can get there head around that suspension Dungy will have more for this series.
@someguy... If Dungey had more intensity on the first 3 laps he'd be unbeatable. I think dunge has more in the tank. He seems to get better and better every week
At this time last year, a lot folks aka the " Reedtards" hahaha... were already starting to hand Reed the title after his 2 overalls in a row..When Reed won the second moto at HT, he was called a " bad dude" and then he was handed the second Moto at Freestone in lieu of RD5's bike issue.....A lot can happen so no need to say this thing is "over" or "wrapped up "......but if the 1-1 results continue for Stewart, only bad luck like Dungey had last year..will end his title hopes....
Dungey has had plenty of seat time on the KTM....they tested outdoors before the SX season started......Stewart rode around on a stock RMZ for a couple days before he signed with and began testing with JGR......big difference in my opinion.....
Wasnt Dungey supposed to "smoke" James at Freestone? Heck even Matthes had Dungey winning atleast one moto.....
I say this....nobody knows what is going to happen.....Stew and Dunge will be the top 2 no doubt...what order....too close to tell at this point...so lets sit back and watch.....In the past, Dungey (during the J-Law days) seemed to get irritated and make mistakes when he had pressure as well.....so it will be interesting to see how things come out when Dungey has the lead and James is playing catch up.....
Hmmmm,, I still trying to figure out where Scrub-This went ????
@ Killimoto.
Good comments but I doubt the Suzuki JS had at home was anywhere near stock! Guys with his talents, perormance needs and money don't have anything that's 'stock'.
Wouldn't be surprised if Suzuki gave him a race bike when they were wooing him prior to his JGR signing.
Hell I'm a 42 yr old has been that never really was and my bike isn't close to stock.
This seems to shaping up to be an epic match up. I hope both of them can keep it up and don't get hurt at any point in the series. Stewart has looked amazing and Dungey proved at Freestone he can match his speed. The Stewart/Dungey match up is kind of like the Johnson/Bailey match up back in '86. If this turns out to be another "Ali/Frazier" rivalry we're all in for a treat this year. Good luck to both.
@Ripdown,, It may not have not been "stock," but I can assure there were no "factory" parts from Zuk on it..
Well then. Since you can 'assure' me of it I must presume you know him so I'll take your word for it. Lol
@Ripdown,, You must not know how factory teams work then. He bought the RMZ off the showroom floor.. If Zuk was going to give him factory parts while he DECIDES on what bike to ride, wouldnt you think Zuk would just give him a bike, instead of him buying one ??? Logical thinking, and thats all it is... The 250 guys dont even gets works suspension for Christ sakes...
Its been mentioned in several articles that James bought a stock Suzuki to ride. Yeah, its probably seen some mods since it came off the showroom floor, but there seems to be some consensus that the factory bike is significantly different. (I'm not sure why this even matters)
I thought Dunge was looking pretty darn smooth on that Kost Too Much. After watching moto 2 again, I had to wonder, if he had gotten around James, could he have pulled a gap ? But that was on a track that Dungey seems to be his best at. Right now, I'd say they are pretty darn equal, and they will both improve. But if forced to pick, I think James will find more comfort ,and therefore more speed, than RD5 as the season goes on.
@ Ripdown - Actually yes, Stewart did have a factory Suzuki in his possesion for a few days...He mentioned in one of his videos that he bought his own stock bike...put some suspension on it or some crap....then when he and Zook starting dealin' they brought him out the goods.....but it was taken away very quickly once the JGR deal was done......he funny part about that interview (video) is you could really tell James was bummed they came and took it.....Its obvious he wanted to go yellow, but they just couldnt put the deal together...so now we see a happy james on a comfy ride....
@real plaque - I agree they are not riding at their full potentinal just yet....However I think, yes just my opinion - I could be wrong, I think your figure that JS7 is riding at 90% and Dungey is riding at 85% is backwards.......RD was pushing to keep up to James in my opinion....If he was faster, he should have been able to get around him, like he passed alessi or Izzi....
I would say Stew is at 94% and Dungey was at 97%
@ KilloMoto
Your right I believe that dungy is cruzin at about 70% and Stweie is WFO meaning this weekend he crashes his brains out
In regards to the 450 class, there are really only two questions. 1 ... Will Stewy go 343 at Lakewood? & 2 ...Can Stewy win both motos AGAIN?
There does not seem to be any reason to debate the 450 class ... unless fans want to discuss whether or not Stewy will have another perfect season.
A lot can happen happen at this level:
So far both have started near the front in all motos . What will one bad start do for either.
At this level a DNF could be the title.
Any rider has a quota of crashes for a season . A big crash could be the title.
A practice crash during the week could be the title. Anyone remember supercross.A crash at anytime could be the title.
Not to mention the racer x cover jinx. Could be the title.
I do not think fitness has really been tested. Was cooler at Texas than normal and Hangtown temps not a real test. Redbud or Milleville at 100 degrees with 90% humidity will test fitness levels. If I remember right 1/2 of the riders did not finish last year at Millevile (was there) and 1 died to due heat at Redbud. Not sure if it will be the title but could affect the title.
The racing is young. 4 of 24 . Having the best coach will help. When its time go. When its time to watch. How to play your cards.
Luck could affect the title.
Whatever happens been a fan for 35 years and great to see good racing. Hope someone steps up to Challenge Dungey and Stewart. Not sure if there is a Baggett clone in the 450 . Hope so.
Speaking of Baggett . I think he has two cans of energy drinks. One day he drinks a Tripes , the next race a Hannah. Or for the younger generation one race a Windham the next a Carmichael. Maybe a sports shrink but whatever. If he believes in himself the competition is in trouble.
Tomac reminds me of an early Hannah . Hungry ,aggressive, and tons of desire. Barcia is often compared to Hannah . If he wanted that comparison to stick it would be the equivilant of racing Stewart and Dungey. Starting in 6th , passing them both and finishing 30 seconds ahead. Then you can say he reminds me of Hannah. Ask Mary Smith. And Hannah was more of an Unknown when he dit that.
whats up with all these idiot talking about these guys riding at 70% 90% 97%. If your part of a gate drop of a AMA national i sure in the hell hope u are riding at 100% if not more. And i am sure everyone is. If your not going to ride 100% of your speed at a national, then when are you?
What about Barcia going up to the 450s when his 250 champ chances are gone (Red Bud)? Can he spoil the party?
About time for shorty to stake a claim. I say Stewart doesnt do it at ThunderValley.I take Dungey Alessi.Short
I love how some guys on here are basking in the glory of Stewart winning, they act like THEY are the ones winning. Its hilarious, they live thier life through someone else. And try to rub it in on someone like they got a great victory or something. Just hope and pray that Stewart and Dungey stay healthy, or the outdoor season will suck. And enjoy the races. Quit acting silly. There isnt anyone on here who knows what really happens at the Stewart camp, the Dungey camp, or anywhere else behind the sences, so dont act like you do, you sound stupid..
Despite never having raced myself, it really seems like I need to stop listening to everyone else and just go with what instincts I have. My first instinct after hearing Stewart to JGR was extreme disappointment that he stayed with the Yamaha and doubt that it would be the fix-all for his career. But the more I heard people hyping his comfort on the new bike, the more I started to believe he would be a real contender on it.
This summer, my instinct was that RD would not be as comfortable going fast on the KTM as he was on the Suzuki. I thought this "fact" would even out he and JS. But the more I heard people shrug off the bike change and slam Stewart's fitness, the more I started to believe that Dungey was going to walk away for the first few rounds like he did at Unadilla.
I think what I'm getting at is that I'm a genius.
@bermblaster - they might mean 85-90% of the pace they'll eventually be running. And it makes some sense, since it's said that you often don't see a rider's best at the first round...so maybe they're working into their speed.
@realmofo - Is it not nice when your guy wins? I think so. With that in mind, though, please keep your enthusiasm in check if Windham ever wins another race or, in a truly crazy twist, a championship. You wouldn't want people to think you think you won.
Also, is it not nice to be proven right? Hell yeah it is! Things will almost certainly change, but four races in it appears that 1) being on the Yamaha was hindering Stewart's performance and 2) that he's still as good an outdoor rider (if not better) than Dungey, two things Stewart critics have been angrily denying for quite a while now.
Yes, I'm basking. Y'all can suck it.
@ therealmofo
Get a clue dude!!!!!!!! If you know anything about the sport you would know that Dungey's first year on the circuit he lived I mean lived at James Stewarts house .Slept,eat.trained with james probably shared malcolm.....get the point
Kills me that someone thinks that RD is still "new" to the bike but JS has been on his for a year.......how stupid!! Pretty well known fact that he has the Yosh for several days but then it went away so he bought a showroom bike!! I personally think he gets 3 or 4 more wins in SX had he been on the Suzuki, i knew when JGR stayed Yamaha that it was a bad deal for him...knew it and stated it back then too!! I don't like to predict, but i think the 1-1 ends this weekend in Colorado, i hope i'm wrong but just not sure he will sweep both!! As far as what percentage these guys are riding at it seems impossible to say, but one thing is for sure, the guy who is being held back in second place is the more likely one to be riding at closer to full potential, i mean why in the hell would you ride at some lower percentile of ability or speed and stay behind and give up the points?? Doesn't make sense!!
@mxmofo ...scrubjs7nuts is now the pugues.....@golfyoda ...I agree RD 5 will have to get aggressive like Barcia might..trade some paint ...oh wait...Didn't you want to OUTLAW such horrible actions and fine those horrible violaters...i sure hope RD5 does it in a polite and orderly fashion of which you would approve and our children will be not be frightened...........or just get the hell in there and bump like a boss and MAKE it happen.......Whoopbliz ..hows the dog.
Dungey may be playing it safe.,, waiting for James to crash out like he does at times....Why get hurt at the begining of the series???
So wasn't JR7's yamaha as good as a factory bike???? Mabey he had a bad year in supercross... Villipoto was there!!!!!!!! LOok at Alessi, his bike is crap and he's making podium and destroying factory racers!!!
@tonewall
Someone told me that you are 5"2" 400 lbs go back to your chips ya dip
How is Alessi's bike "crap"??? You guys KILL me!!
Whatever- I wouldn't think they would wanna run at anywhere near 100% in their second ever outdoors race on a new bike- they know the importance of being in it for the long haul- why push it now while there both still learning the machines? One big endo and they are on the couch with Villopoto Canard and Reed- which is probably the last place on earth they want to be this summer- I think patience is more important now than ever before. I dont see Dungey as getting blown off by Stewart as much as just being patient. He has only missed 6 weeks of racing in six years as a pro- thats better than being on the couch with his 'more aggressive' rivals. And he has as many ama titles as Reed has in ten years of trying- not too bad.
I can see either one of these dudes running down the other from 5+ seconds back. The only difference is, Stewart would make the pass but Dungey would just sit there.
I kinda hope James gets beaten soon, actually. Take some of the win streak pressure off before he cracks. Or does Dungey not bother him that much, like they discussed on the podcast?
Anyone think the pace this year matches last year's?
@tonewall - He went the way of jairtime.
Dungey would bother Stewy if Dungey sacked up.
AKA, Dungey needs to sack up!
@pugue.....lol....sorry i didn't realize you were 10. ... Whoops ...your dog got tired of the whooopins ,ran away and joined the klan..? . @whatever I also don't understand the rip on MikeyA's bike. It seems to get good starts and work fine ...he fades to the front runners but so does everybody behind him ,some of which are on factory Hondas and Kaws and highly modified Yamahas. Anybody thinking the front guys are not running near 100% is kidding themselves ...watch Moto2 again...their racing to win a national .in the heat.and pushin it. Is anyone else on a KTM ...I haven't seen any...seems like its startin to work damn good.
@bermblaster - Regarding the % mumbo jumbo....I was being somewhat sarcastic, if you couldnt tell by my rather strange numbers.... Although debating what percent of skill, speed or agression a rider is riding at....it is safe to say that they are still getting better each week....You listen to James interviews and he mentioned several times at Hangtown, " i felt better as the race went on".....Surely James has to brush off some outdoor cobwebs, while Dungey was out there racing moto just 8 months ago.....Bottom line, I think both guys have more in the tank as they say and they will improve bike set up a little each weak.....but they both look pretty Fukin good right now....thats for sure....Colorado will be epic
You RD fans make the dumbest excuses, the fact is JS has him covered.
@therealpugue---What point are you trying to make?? Do you even know?? Just quit being a Tard and be a fan, and enjoy the season. Why turn everything into a battle of insults?? You arent very bright and are making an as$ out of yourself. Grow up..
Nobody's gone anywhere BillC. Dungey fans are posting more than ever on here. We are ready to light it up on here when the Dunge starts winning these things and Stewie starts planting that Suzuki and shows us all that he hasn't matured a bit.
Whatever: It is well know that Stewie has been riding a Suzuki for months now. JGR was well aware of it. He was testing that thing while he was pretending to be injured during Supercross. When RD starts spanking that butt he'll be injured again I'm sure.
Hey Whatever, lol, I 'm sure Mike Alessi has a desent bike but the factory guys obviously have a better bike!! Lighter bikes make riding less tiring...The big factory teams have bigger budgets so i'm sure that makes thing easier..
.I"m sure other people on here could describe better what advantage a factory teams have over the smaller teams like MIke Alessi's team....
@RCRDDW, there is no way Stewart was riding the FACTORY YOSHIMURA Suzuki while he was still with JGR.......the production bike is what he was riding if he was on a Suzuki during that time!!! Tool!!!
@Whatever--How do you know????? Guess what, you dont. Stewart said himself he WAS SENT bikes from Suzuki and Honda. Before he signed with JGR.. He bought a Kawi himself and a KTM. He said this in an interview with ESPNGO.. So I would think Suzuki would send him the best one they had to try and get him to ride for them right??? YOU sounded like a tool there./.